Forth Book: Programming for the Utter Beginner

[Buzz McCool]

I ran across this transcript in the ACM archives
https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/142835.142850
which mentions a Forth book called "Programming for the Utter Beginner"
by Michael Ham of Laboratory Microsystems Inc.

I searched for a paper or electronic version in the usual places but was
unable to determine if it actually exists. Is anyone aware of where I
could view or obtain a copy?

[mhx]

Post by Buzz McCool
I ran across this transcript in the ACM archives
https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/142835.142850
which mentions a Forth book called "Programming for the Utter Beginner"
by Michael Ham of Laboratory Microsystems Inc.
I searched for a paper or electronic version in the usual places but was
unable to determine if it actually exists. Is anyone aware of where I
could view or obtain a copy?

Are your sure it's not his DDJ column collection? (DDJ online is unusable,
unfortunately). The title does not look like something that would get past
a copy editor :--)

-marcel

[mhx]

Post by mhx
Are your sure it's not his DDJ column collection? (DDJ online is unusable,
unfortunately). The title does not look like something that would get past
a copy editor :--)

Too fast. All DDJ issues are available here in their full glory:
https://archive.org/details/1987-08-dr-dobbs-journal/page/n5/mode/2up .

-marcel

PS: I also see dozens of Forth books, manuals, and implementation guides.
No trace of any *book* by Michael Ham, though.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Thu, 25 Apr 2024 20:26:26 +0000

Post by mhx

Post by mhx
Are your sure it's not his DDJ column collection? (DDJ online is unusable,
unfortunately). The title does not look like something that would get past
a copy editor :--)

https://archive.org/details/1987-08-dr-dobbs-journal/page/n5/mode/2up .
-marcel
PS: I also see dozens of Forth books, manuals, and implementation guides.
No trace of any *book* by Michael Ham, though.

They (pun intended)'d be in trouble these days:


The program must meet users’ rea-
sonable expectations. For example,
in one program it is necessary to de-
termine the user’s sex. For consisten-
cy with earlier menus, the user is
asked to respond to the menu “1—
Female, 2—Male,” but the program
accepts F, f, M, and m in addition to 1
and 2. S


Yes, Sex <>Gender. But what is this program doing? Giving prostate/breast
cancer advise?

[Bigtreeman]

Alas, when the Forth branch was falling off the programming tree

Post by mhx

Post by mhx
Are your sure it's not his DDJ column collection? (DDJ online is unusable,
unfortunately). The title does not look like something that would get
past a copy editor :--)

https://archive.org/details/1987-08-dr-dobbs-journal/page/n5/mode/2up .
-marcel
PS: I also see dozens of Forth books, manuals, and implementation guides.
No trace of any *book* by Michael Ham, though.

[dxf]

Post by Buzz McCool
I ran across this transcript in the ACM archives
https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/142835.142850
which mentions a Forth book called "Programming for the Utter Beginner" by Michael Ham of Laboratory Microsystems Inc.
I searched for a paper or electronic version in the usual places but was unable to determine if it actually exists. Is anyone aware of where I could view or obtain a copy?

Never came across the book but the companion forth compiler bundled with it
is here:

ftp://ftp.taygeta.com/pub/Forth/Compilers/native/dos/FirstForth.zip

Perhaps someone knows the corresponding http link (assuming that still exists).
The Taygeta forth archive search facility at forth.org seems to be broken.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Fri, 26 Apr 2024 09:08:04 +1000

Post by dxf

Post by Buzz McCool
I ran across this transcript in the ACM archives
https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/142835.142850
which mentions a Forth book called "Programming for the Utter Beginner" by Michael Ham of Laboratory Microsystems Inc.
I searched for a paper or electronic version in the usual places but was unable to determine if it actually exists. Is anyone aware of where I could view or obtain a copy?

Never came across the book but the companion forth compiler bundled with it
ftp://ftp.taygeta.com/pub/Forth/Compilers/native/dos/FirstForth.zip
Perhaps someone knows the corresponding http link (assuming that still exists).
The Taygeta forth archive search facility at forth.org seems to be broken.

It says in the 'read.me'

When your payment is received, you will be shipped a copy of
*Programming for the Utter Beginner*. Your registration will be
recorded so that you will receive information on any upgrades to
FIRST/FORTH and on other LMI products. In addition, you will
receive a credit of $20 toward the purchase of UR/FORTH or WinForth.


So the 'bundling' goes the other way!

[Buzz McCool]

Post by Buzz McCool
I ran across this transcript in the ACM archives
https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/142835.142850
which mentions a Forth book called "Programming for the Utter Beginner" by Michael Ham of Laboratory Microsystems Inc.
I searched for a paper or electronic version in the usual places but was unable to determine if it actually exists. Is anyone aware of where I could view or obtain a copy?

On 4/26/2024 12:56 PM, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote: ...


Thanks for the detective work.

No sign of that book, but I did stumble across this November 1983
Laboratory Microsystems price list which may of historical interest to
some of you: https://tinyurl.com/mwvtvyht

[dxf]

Post by Kerr-Mudd, John
On Fri, 26 Apr 2024 09:08:04 +1000

Post by dxf

Post by Buzz McCool
I ran across this transcript in the ACM archives
https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/142835.142850
which mentions a Forth book called "Programming for the Utter Beginner" by Michael Ham of Laboratory Microsystems Inc.
I searched for a paper or electronic version in the usual places but was unable to determine if it actually exists. Is anyone aware of where I could view or obtain a copy?

Never came across the book but the companion forth compiler bundled with it
ftp://ftp.taygeta.com/pub/Forth/Compilers/native/dos/FirstForth.zip
Perhaps someone knows the corresponding http link (assuming that still exists).
The Taygeta forth archive search facility at forth.org seems to be broken.

It says in the 'read.me'
When your payment is received, you will be shipped a copy of
*Programming for the Utter Beginner*. Your registration will be
recorded so that you will receive information on any upgrades to
FIRST/FORTH and on other LMI products. In addition, you will
receive a credit of $20 toward the purchase of UR/FORTH or WinForth.
So the 'bundling' goes the other way!

Nor a particularly attractive bundle. $50 bought you a book for a crippled (IIRC)
compiler. At this time F-PC was free and doing the rounds of bulletin boards.
One could buy 'Starting Forth' 2nd Ed ($29) and still have change in the pocket.

Found these old posts:

https://groups.google.com/g/comp.lang.forth/c/zPIjr10Sf54/m/m6Ygp7jXol8J

https://groups.google.com/g/comp.lang.forth/c/Sq8mpnyB5qA/m/VRXw7MNoQmsJ

[mhx]

dxf wrote:
[..]

Post by dxf
Nor a particularly attractive bundle.

[..]

The price alone says nothing. What was the quality of the compiler compared
to equivalent systems?

If (from that page) I add up the prices of all the packages that nowadays
seem essential, I come to $1,500. In 1986 this was equivalent in purchasing
power to about $4,274.62 today. In today's reality, that is about 40 to 100
times as much as people are prepared to pay for any piece of software based
on an add in their favorite magazine (or that I myself would have been *able*
to pay as a student in that era).

What does this say? I don't know.

Post by dxf
$50 bought you a book for a crippled (IIRC) compiler. At this time F-PC was
free and doing the rounds of bulletin boards.

Are sure about that date? I thought F-PC came much later, in 1994.
Downloading 1 MBytes through a 300 Baud connection takes ~30,000 seconds
or 9 hours and 25 minutes.

-marcel

[dxf]

Post by mhx
[..]

Nor a particularly attractive bundle. 

[..]
The price alone says nothing. What was the quality of the compiler compared
to equivalent systems?

IIRC it was DTC which puts performance in the same class as F-PC. It came
with no sources - not even for the extensions (DOS, SFP). Only in its last
days did LMI offer 'shareware' products. To what extent LMI would have
supported these, we'll never know.

Post by mhx
If (from that page) I add up the prices of all the packages that nowadays seem essential, I come to $1,500. In 1986 this was equivalent in purchasing
power to about $4,274.62 today. In today's reality, that is about 40 to 100
times as much as people are prepared to pay for any piece of software based
on an add in their favorite magazine (or that I myself would have been *able*
to pay as a student in that era).
What does this say? I don't know.

Today it's a buyer's market.

Post by mhx

$50 bought you a book for a crippled (IIRC) compiler.  At this time F-PC was
free and doing the rounds of bulletin boards.

Are sure about that date? I thought F-PC came much later, in 1994.
Downloading 1 MBytes through a 300 Baud connection takes ~30,000 seconds or 9 hours and 25 minutes.
-marcel

1994 is when ANS emerged effectively killing interest in F-FPC. F-PC was around
long before 1992.

[Paul Rubin]

Post by mhx
Are sure about that date? I thought F-PC came much later, in 1994.
Downloading 1 MBytes through a 300 Baud connection takes ~30,000
seconds or 9 hours and 25 minutes.

By 1994, modems were a lot faster (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USRobotics):

In 1986, USR introduced their Courier HST, short for "high speed
transfer". Using trellis encoding, HST provided 9,600 bit/s speeds,
leapfrogging the standards efforts and offering four times the
performance for about twice the price of a 2400 bit/s model. In 1989
HST was expanded to 14.4 kbit/s, 16.8 kbit/s in 1992,[6] and finally
to 21 kbit/s and 24 kbit/s.